Curse

Theosebes · Oct 31, 2006, 05:06 PM // 17:06

This is my first post on these forums, although I have often visited to look around, and to check things like the auctions, and info on new things.

I have posted this on other sites only to have it relagated to the suggestions forum or nobody reads it because it was too long winded. I will try to be more consice here.

I would like to see a rule change with the Templates. Right now it is considered a violation of the TOS and EULA to create, edit, modify, or display the template files used by GW by anything other than the GW client.

I would like to be able to do things like write a build program that outputs a templte file that I can use in GW. Or perhaps a team builder that I can use to send the builds to each of the team members so they can load it up quickly.

Right now to do that outside of GW is a bannable offense. I would like to request that Anet allows us to create or edit these files manually without it being a violation of the TOS and EULA

What do you think. Would you like for Anet to give us permission to do that? An example would be:
Back a ways I was using a 3rd party program to build a theoretical GvG build that I wanted to test out. Once I had everything threshed out in the Builder program, I had to manually post the attributes, runes, skills, armor, weapons and items, etc... to the guild forum and then each person who wanted to use the builds had to manually set them up in Guild Wars.

If they gave us permision to create the build files, all I would have to do is write down the code needed, and send them the text file, and they load the template, and we would be ready.

Thanks for your time and feedback

MDeshame · Oct 31, 2006, 05:40 PM // 17:40

Nightfalls
Save Builds.
No third party password stealling hack required.

Theosebes · Oct 31, 2006, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Wow, I was hoping for a little more useful feedback than that.

I am a software developer. One of the main reasons I want to be able to do this is so that the program I am writing can take advantage of the templates for one huge reason:

I request at installation that the user install the program on a computer that does not have GW installed. I am even considering making it impossible to install upon detecting a GW installation. The reason why is that for those that choose to use this just-for-fun program, i want to be %100 sure that nobody is going to attach a keylogger to my program.

But even beyond that, if all I was able to do was to have a personal program on just my computer that could convert what I enter as the build into the properly formatted text for a template, then all I would need to do is simply enter that manually one time, and I could then use it as a team builder tool for my guild. I could distribute the template files for our builds and the members wouldn't have to go through the time of setting stuff up every time we have a change in rolls or builds for a GvG.

I was hoping for the change even if all I ever do is help out our Guild/Alliance by posting templates. It would bea time saver for everyone, and help out with team builds a ton. Nothing would ever need to be installed on anyones machine. I just want to be able to create the text from scratch before posting to a site without it being a violation.

DeathByBowtie · Oct 31, 2006, 08:20 PM // 20:20

You can send your builds to your teammates. Your saved builds are located in C:\Program Files\Guld Wars\Templates as a .txt file named whatever you saved the build as. If you email the text file to your guildies, they can drop it in their Templates folder and load it right up. (At least I'm pretty sure that's how it works, I haven't had a chance to explore it beyond the fact that that folder and the text files in it exist.)

Theosebes · Oct 31, 2006, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Yes. That is the way that it currently works. And by no means do I dislike it. I love the template system. However, in making a team build for example, in order to distribute the builds you have to open GW, make the build, save the template, then send the file.

What I am hoping to be able to do is to do this: When I come up with the build, simply write the code out myself (it is only about a dozen and a half characters long) and post it directly to the email or website without even launching Guild Wars.

This would allow more flexibility in Team builds because with a "cheat sheet" or conversion program, you could write out the code in a few seconds as opposed to the 5 minutes for each build save.

There is a fine line though in just posting the code to a website or sending the file via email, (which is valid and acceptable under the TOS and EULA) and being able to edit them, make changes, or create them from scratch. (which isn't allowed under the TOS and EULA)

aeroclown · Oct 31, 2006, 08:29 PM // 20:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathByBowtie

You can send your builds to your teammates. Your saved builds are located in C:\Program Files\Guld Wars\Templates as a .txt file named whatever you saved the build as. If you email the text file to your guildies, they can drop it in their Templates folder and load it right up. (At least I'm pretty sure that's how it works, I haven't had a chance to explore it beyond the fact that that folder and the text files in it exist.)

Hi,

I don't know if you actually read through the post that the op made, but I would like you to note the part where it says "Right now to do that outside of GW is a bannable offense. I would like to request that Anet allows us to create or edit these files manually without it being a violation of the TOS and EULA"

DeathByBowtie · Oct 31, 2006, 08:58 PM // 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeroclown

Hi,

I don't know if you actually read through the post that the op made, but I would like you to note the part where it says "Right now to do that outside of GW is a bannable offense. I would like to request that Anet allows us to create or edit these files manually without it being a violation of the TOS and EULA"

I did read the original post, and the way I read it, his complaint was that you couldn't share your builds with other people, which I didn't know until yesterday was a feature of the Templates system, so I figured he might not know; if he didn't, he would be enlightened, and if he did, well, no harm done.

An external editor would be pretty nice, now that I think about it, even if it's just for my own use (trying a build from on here or something without switching back and forth between Firefox and GW). Which part of the EULA says you can't edit the template files (I skimmed it really quick, but I'm in class and trying to devote at least half my brain to learning :-p).

Theosebes · Oct 31, 2006, 09:10 PM // 21:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathByBowtie

An external editor would be pretty nice, now that I think about it, even if it's just for my own use (trying a build from on here or something without switching back and forth between Firefox and GW). Does the EULA say why you can't edit those files, or just that it's a no-no?

Specifically, because the program that I am working on would be a million times better if it could output templates for use in GW, I wrote support because sections 3 and 7 of the EULA can be interpreted either way. Support let me know in no uncertain terms that the template files are part of the GW client, and cannot be edited (manually or otherwise), displayed by an outside program, or created by anything except the GW client.

Becuase I am not willing to violate the EULA or TOS, and refuse to create a tool that would allow others to violate it, my program will be bulky and difficult to use. I can live with that. I would prefer a slight change in the rules to allow folks like me (and the genius behing The Edge program) to output those files and share them easily.

=HT=Ingram · Oct 31, 2006, 11:32 PM // 23:32

the text files are scrambled anyhow so its not as easy as you may think...

Tetris L · Nov 10, 2006, 08:39 AM // 08:39

I really don't see a reason why the template files are "encrypted" in the first place. ANet could have used a simple code (similar to a windows .ini or .sys file or so) that can be edited in wordpad! I don't see any potential for abuse.

Faer · Nov 10, 2006, 09:24 AM // 09:24

GWFreaks (for example) with a Template Builder option would be heaven. Now if only we were allowed to do that...

Oh, wait a second!

/signed

[BtL] poke · Nov 24, 2006, 02:08 PM // 14:08

signed.
I would like to read a comment from some official (Gaile) on this.

WNxTilly · Nov 24, 2006, 03:46 PM // 15:46

Signed,

I'm someone who has managed to do this. (Create both skills and templates codes) I wont release the code and wont use it but I have done. I have also created viewers for equipment and skills.

I really want this so that my clanmate's build designer will work so much quicker and we can easily download these templates.

Tilly

CoRrRan · Nov 24, 2006, 03:46 PM // 15:46

/signed

In the interest of gwbbcode and gwshack.

liu pi · Nov 24, 2006, 03:57 PM // 15:57

GWFreaks, gwBBCode, gwShack.us and many more programs support template file viewing and creation already. I didn't know ANet was against it and I'll remove template support from the software projects I lead the second they ask me to.

In the meantime I sign this petition, hoping for ANet to encourage creativity regarding templates!

Jyro X · Dec 07, 2006, 07:34 AM // 07:34

"To save a Skill Template, click the disk icon inside the Skills and Attributes panel, then click “Save to Template.” The template will be saved to a small file in the Templates/Skills folder below the Guild Wars installation directory. You can copy this file to other computers, share it with your friends, or post it on the Internet." - [Wednesday October 25].

They buried themselves. If that is an actual quote from A-Net that the dude recieved in an email, then the guy that wrote that to him blatantly went against this statement posted on the official guild wars site. I see no legality issues other than internal. GuildWiki and other sites are not in violation with anything. That quote from their official site gives you permission to post your templates on websites and share with other users.

Theosebes · Dec 07, 2006, 05:34 PM // 17:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jyro X

They buried themselves. If that is an actual quote from A-Net that the dude recieved in an email, then the guy that wrote that to him blatantly went against this statement posted on the official guild wars site. I see no legality issues other than internal. GuildWiki and other sites are not in violation with anything. That quote from their official site gives you permission to post your templates on websites and share with other users.

Hey, thanks for your post. what the website mentions, and allows, is direct sharing. Un-modified direct sharing of those files. That is permitted. What my hope is, is that they would permit creation of those files from scratch, and modifying of those files, which is what is currently not permitted. If your friend sends you a necro 55 build, you take a look at it, and want to use it on an ele, currently there is no way to do that. If they allowed modifying it, you simply change the primary to ele, and you're done. If GuildWiki has a great new build, or you read about one on a forum, and they don't have a code there, I want to be able to create that from scratch. That is what is not permitted right now.

monk of base · Dec 07, 2006, 06:11 PM // 18:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theosebes

If GuildWiki has a great new build, or you read about one on a forum, and they don't have a code there, I want to be able to create that from scratch. That is what is not permitted right now.

/signed.

I'd really love to see something like this working - good luck!

Monk of Base.

Jyro X · Dec 08, 2006, 05:48 AM // 05:48

/signed

Mesmer in Need · Dec 08, 2006, 05:59 AM // 05:59

no need. if you go into a build maker thing like gw shack, you can create different builds using different skills. on gw shack, there is a picture by the build, and if you click on it it brings up a notepad document saying randome letters. but, if you type this code into the save template feature of gw as the name, it will create the build for you if you have all the skills. atleast i think this is what it does.